Mel Marshall MBE talks swimming success, poolside leadership, and unlocking potential

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Karen Falcon (Host, Performance & Development Lead at Tenzing):
Hello, and welcome to The Ascent. I’m Karen Falcon, Performance and Development Lead at Tenzing. We’re a private equity firm passionate about the human stories between high-growth businesses and teams. Guy, the co-founder of Tenzing, and I talk to some of the most driven and insightful founders, CEOs, and high performers. Previous series have focused on the tech world, and now we’re looking beyond. We talk through the highs, the lows, and everything in between. We’re diving deep into what fuels them, how they build standout teams, and keep pushing boundaries. No topic is off limit, and every conversation is packed with lessons that you can apply to your own journey.

In today’s episode, Guy Gillon (Co-Founder of Tenzing) is joined by someone whose impact on British swimming is hard to overstate — Mel Marshall (Olympic Coach, former elite swimmer, and one of the UK’s most decorated Commonwealth athletes).

A former elite swimmer herself, Mel was one of the most decorated Commonwealth athletes of her time before transitioning into coaching. And that’s where her story really takes off.

We talk about her journey from standing on the podium to standing on the pool deck, the mindset required to compete at the highest level, and how that mindset evolved into her mission, helping others unlock their potential. If you’re interested in performance, leadership, or simply what it takes to be world class, in or out of the pool, this one’s for you.

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Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
Thanks Mel for joining us, we really appreciate you spending time with us. I’d love to know when you first knew you were going to be a swimmer.

Mel Marshall:
So when I first knew I was going to be a swimmer, there’s a whole host of stories but I think the first one I’m going to go to is when I was younger I actually did fall in my granddad’s fish pond. That was one of the things, but also my parents were really keen on keeping me active.

We used to go to a very small swimming pool in Spalding. From the age of whatever, I imagined that I knew everything about swimming, even though I didn’t. So my dad tried to teach me, my mum took me, and we just went from there really. My mum took me three times a week. I saw a swimming club training at the same time as me and I was trying to beat them. We decided to join the swimming club, and it just grew from there.

I loved it instantly. I always loved all kinds of sports, but this was the one that really got me hooked very quickly. It just fed my competitiveness. First it was try and win the lane, then try and win the group, then the club championships, then try and be the best in the county. You could see that progression, and my competitive side just kept being fuelled.

Guy:
Were you instantly good?

Mel:
I was a good wriggler, as I would say.

Guy:
What’s a good wriggler?

Mel:
Well, my arms and legs went around quickly and I moved quickly, but I wasn’t that great until I was probably about 12. Then I did a few more sessions, my coach really helped me with my technique, and at 12–13 it kicked off. I made my first junior international at the age of 13 — the European Youth Olympics in Bath.

After that I continued my junior career, but I had a plateau at 17–18, because I’d discovered what it was to be 17–18. There were things socially that were much more fun than just going up and down a swimming pool.

I just missed the Sydney Olympics by six one-hundredths, but I hadn’t really taken preparation that seriously. At that point, I made the decision that if I was going to do it, I should do it properly. That’s when I decided to go to Loughborough University and transfer my course there. The coaches were great, really welcoming, and my senior career took off from that point.

Transcript (Section 2)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
So the senior career really started in 2000, wasn’t it? Was it a surprise to miss out?

Mel Marshall:
I think it was. I made the World Championships in 1998 when I was only 15. Had I pulled out the same performance in 2000, I would have been going to the Olympics. But again, I was 17–18 and I was doing what 17–18 year olds do.

I did push myself in preparation for the Olympic trials, but I only started about 10 weeks out — when I should have been doing it from 32 weeks out. I left it too late and I deserved to miss out, 100%.

From that point, it made me think: imagine if I took this seriously all the time. That’s when I made the move to Loughborough University. Travel had been a big issue for me — I lived in Lincolnshire, so it was 45 minutes to the pool, 45 minutes back. Sessions started at 5 a.m., so I was up at 4 a.m. throughout my teens. Then school, then evening training until 9 p.m. It just wore me down. Moving to Loughborough made everything easier and my career really took off from there.

Guy:
And Loughborough is now world-renowned as an aquatics hub. What was it like back in 2000?

Mel:
Interestingly, the amount of success that came out of the facility back then was incredible, considering what we had. It was just a 25-yard, high-sided pool with four lanes. But there were great coaches — Ian Armiger, who was the director of swimming for a long time, and Ben Titley.

There was great coaching, great innovation, great energy, and we had an amazing group. That success led to the building of the 50-metre pool and the upgraded facilities. That’s how the journey went.

Guy:
When did Bill Sweetenham get involved?

Mel:
He came into British swimming from 2000, after Sydney.

Guy:
Right. Not a huge swimmer himself, but a big personality, let’s put it that way.

Mel:
Yes, exactly. I must admit, I moved from being a good swimmer to a great swimmer because of him. But it also went too far at times. At Athens, a lot of us probably suffered from too much intensity.

Still, Bill pushed me to a new level. I moved into a new realm of physical preparation I never thought possible. He gave me challenges that I didn’t think I could do, but I had no choice — I had to do them. That pushed me past a crazy threshold into a new space, and that was good coaching at the time. I’d never have done it on my own.

I’m still friends with him now — every time I go to Australia we meet for a coffee. It’s supposed to be half an hour and ends up four hours! He’ll then say, “Let’s meet tomorrow,” and I’m like: we covered everything yesterday, Bill!

Guy:
Were you aware at the time that you’d gone from good to great?

Mel:
Yes, there was definitely a shift. My level of preparation went up massively. My technique held under pressure because of that training, whereas before it might have broken down.

Guy:
And you were one of the most decorated Commonwealth athletes.

Mel:
I’m not sure I still am, but it stood for a long time. I’m well up there.

Guy:
What’s the difference between Commonwealth and Olympic cycles?

Mel:
The Commonwealth Games are amazing, but they’re the “friendly games.” Canada are good, Australia are good, and we’re good, but split into England, Scotland, Wales. The depth of competition is nowhere near an Olympics.

If I’d won six Olympic medals, I’d be on book tours and driving a Mercedes! It’s just a much lower level of depth compared to the Olympics.

Transcript (Section 3)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
And now you’re a super established coach. Looking back at yourself as an athlete, were there early signs that you’d go into coaching — either in how you managed yourself or developed yourself?

Mel Marshall:
For me, I always wanted to be a PE teacher. When I was younger, I did a lot of coaching in different sports. I was coaching sixth form boys’ football when I was in year 11. I wanted to submerse myself in challenges.

At 17–18, I did a coaching and sports course that changed my life. I had brilliant teachers too. I kind of knew swimming would end one day, so I backed myself up by learning how to write lesson plans and coaching plans.

As a “star athlete” I’d often be sent to small swimming clubs. You’d end up in the middle of Pembrokeshire with a four-lane pool, 120 kids there to see you, and you’d have to entertain them for four hours. I had to develop a formula for how to coach them — and that’s when the athlete and coach sides started to marry together.

I retired in 2008 and had six months left to finish my degree. I thought, I’ll take a chance on coaching, see if I like it. I applied for two jobs — one didn’t give me an interview, the other gave me the job. From there I never looked back. I loved it straight away. Coaching serviced my thirst to be a teacher and harnessed my competitiveness to be in the pursuit of better.

Guy:
That was a community pool in Derby, right?

Mel:
Yes, it was.

Guy:
Who hired you, and what did you think you were signing up for compared to what it became?

Mel:
I knew it was a small programme. They had about 10 regional-standard swimmers. The history there was that once swimmers reached a certain level, they were expected to move on to bigger programmes.

But I thought: let’s make the best of what we’ve got. If people want to leave, fine. If not, they can stay. I added more pool time, created more opportunities, and just gave them everything I could. Looking back now, it was perfect timing. I was 26, naïve, and had the energy of ten wildcats. The kids were thrilled to have someone who wanted to give them the best opportunities. It was a perfect match.

Guy:
Did you have a goal when you first arrived?

Mel:
Yes. I’d been told we couldn’t have any national qualifiers because we were just a small feeder club. I really wanted a national qualifier. The first was Becky Jones, who got a 200m backstroke time. She could have left, but she stayed loyal to me and the programme. She qualified and even won a little silver medal.

That success bred more belief. One qualifier turned into two, then three. My real goal was to show kids they could dream big and build a culture of excellence.

We celebrated everything. We had a “Top Gun board” — if you qualified for counties, you signed it. If you qualified for Midlands, you walked down the “Tunnel of Love.” If you got a national time, you did a lap of honour around the pool. We lived that culture every day. I think very fondly of those years.

Some people worry about competitive parents, but I had a wonderful group who were incredibly supportive. They took their kids swimming six or seven times a week, then still had the energy to run tombolas! Everything was a first: winning the Diddy League, then the Arena League. Such great memories.

Guy:
The way you describe it, you were almost the CEO of the club. How many kids did you have?

Mel:
We had 500 athletes, plus all their parents. Some pools were council-owned, so I had to manage those relationships too.

Guy:
And coaches?

Mel:
I inherited about 12–14 coaches, all volunteers. I was the only paid person.

Guy:
So not just coaching — a massive organisational challenge. Did you realise that at the time?

Mel:
Not at all. I thought coaching was mornings and evenings with free time in between. I couldn’t have been further from the truth! It was 100 miles an hour, never stopping. And in a volunteer environment, there isn’t much protection. I was 26 and they took a risk on me in such a big role.

There were heavy issues too: a parent suicide, missing money, safeguarding problems, kids struggling with self-harm. I was 26, working with volunteers, trying to manage all that. It was a huge shock.

When I left, every staff member was paid — even if just enough to cover parking. That was important to me. Everyone should be remunerated for their work.

Transcript (Section 4)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
So you were in Derby for eight years. In that time, did you develop systems for running the club, managing the organisation, and coaching individuals? By then you had Adam as well, so you must have been wearing three — if not more — hats.

Mel Marshall:
Oh yeah, a thousand hats! I was fundraiser, organiser, relationship manager with the council, priest, counsellor, second parent, coach, direction setter, kit organiser — everything. Coaching was the last thing you did after removing all the other jobs.

But it taught me to prioritise: what matters? What’s my job? There’s no medal for admin, so that goes last.

Guy:
And what about talent spotting? How did you define talent when you first started coaching?

Mel:
I was lucky. I’d just come out of the sport myself, so I had a good eye. Like an artist recognising good art, I could see raw capability.

Guy:
And when does attitude start to matter?

Mel:
At the start, my job was to create good attitudes. I had kids from 9 to 16 — a real imprint stage. I think about leadership in three ways:

• Front leadership: when they’re young, you set direction, instruct, give clear messages.
  
• Side leadership: as they grow, it becomes a partnership. I’m still the decision maker, but I get their input.
  
• Back leadership: once they’re mature and know where they’re going, I step back and they lead, coming to me for advice.
  

In Derby, it was front leadership. As they matured, it shifted to side and back. Coaching is about moving between those modes depending on the athlete and circumstances.

Guy:
When Adam first came to you, did you think he could go all the way?

Mel:
At first? No. He came with a friend. He was big for the group, in the third lane, and his freestyle wasn’t impressive. Then I saw him swim breaststroke at speed — that was different.

The challenge was he lived 45 minutes to an hour away. At first he only came twice a week. Once we got him to five or six times a week, the improvement curve was fast.

By 17, I knew. I stood up in a coaches’ meeting and said: “He’ll go 57.” The world record was 58.4. Everyone laughed — but I knew.

In 2014, he won the Commonwealth Games in 58.9. By April 2015 he went 57.9 — under the world record by nearly half a second. Ridiculous.

Guy:
So by then you’d been coaching him seven years?

Mel:
Yes, I picked him up in 2009. By 2015 it had been seven years.

Guy:
Did he buy into it straight away?

Mel:
It took some convincing. But once he saw results — five sessions making him a second faster — he was addicted. It became his thing.

For me, it was about planting seeds. Influencing him and his family to see his potential. It’s a huge investment for families: petrol, hotels, finance, time. They had to believe it was worthwhile too.

Guy:
But you always coached a cohort, not just him?

Mel:
Yes. Always a group.

Guy:
And you left Derby in 2017?

Mel:
Yes, just after Rio. I handed in my notice, had three months off, then moved to Loughborough.

Transcript (Section 5)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
When you’re working with athletes, you’ve spoken about matching your style to theirs. Obviously, when you’ve got a long relationship you can work that out, but to have an instant impact, do you have shortcuts for understanding how to coach someone?

Mel Marshall:
Yes — it’s the quality of your questions at the start. That’s vital. Have three critical questions that help you get to know someone quickly. That, plus time.

My talent is people. I can read a room quickly, build good connections fast. That’s my strength.

Guy:
Adam’s quite emotionally driven, but you’ve also had athletes who are more data- or technique-driven. Which is more natural for you?

Mel:
Definitely emotion. Those who are data-led push me to stretch myself. I can do it, and it’s been good for me to unpick how to unlock different people, but emotion is more natural to me.

Guy:
In Derby you described being always “on, on, on.” We sometimes talk about “walk, jog, run.” Do you adopt that in cycles?

Mel:
In Derby it was more like: walk, jog, run, then panic!

But yes, in Olympic four-year cycles I think of it this way:

• Year 1: discovery
  
• Year 2: innovation
  
• Year 3: work at it — systems in place, push, push, push
  
• Year 4: refine
  

That pattern gives space for discovery and world-leading innovation early on, then consolidation and refinement before the Games.

Guy:
Do you ever get halfway through a cycle and feel unhappy with the direction?

Mel:
Yes, regularly. That’s when I think of the “Friends” scene — pivot! It’s about being flexible and agile. You’d love things to go A–B–C–D, but they don’t.

Guy:
You also use mountain analogies. Can you talk about “Mapping the Mountain”?

Mel:
Yes. It’s a metaphor for performance. When you climb a mountain, there are days with no oxygen, bad weather, blizzards, or beautiful sunshine. That’s like training weeks.

Mapping the Mountain is about accepting the terrain you’re on and having a plan for inevitable challenges. For example: October will be gloomy because training is heavy, there’s no rest period, it’s too far from Christmas to be excited. So how do we make the best of it?

It’s about plotting small goals, visualising how things will feel, and preparing for them.

Guy:
And when athletes start at Loughborough, they all want to summit — to be top of the world, to make the Olympics. At some point, though, you have to cut the rope. How do you think about that?

Mel:
It has to be evidence-based decisions with feelings-based communication. Facts and data, but expressed with empathy.

And everyone knows the rules before climbing. Not everyone will summit. That’s accepted. But when the rope is cut, there has to be a rescue team. Yes, the decision is final, but the athlete is not left on their own.

Transcript (Section 6)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
Do many athletes make good coaches?

Mel Marshall:
It took me a long time to gain credibility because I was an athlete. People often thought athletes don’t make good coaches. And I can see why — some athletes would never be able to see things from different perspectives.

Athletes are inherently selfish. They have to be, that’s why they’re good. Coaches are the opposite — you’re giving everything to others. That’s a big shift.

But there is a big knowledge set if you’ve done it. The key is whether you can translate your experience to be relevant for someone else. That takes communication skills and self-awareness.

Guy:
And adversity? Those tough moments as an athlete — how have they shaped you?

Mel:
Athens 2004 was huge for me. I didn’t deliver, and that changed everything. If I’d come away with a medal, maybe I’d have faded out of the sport. Missing out gave me a sustainable career beyond that point.

Going into coaching was another big one. Derby took a chance on me — I hadn’t even finished my Level 3 qualification when I started.

And people. I’ve met some great people who’ve had a big impact on me. But I’ve also met some not-so-great people who’ve had an even bigger impact. If you say “no” or “you can’t,” something in me rises to that challenge. I thank the people who got in my way — they made me more competitive.

Guy:
And inspiration? In Derby you were running the programme, not surrounded by senior coaches, not always welcome as a former athlete. Who inspired you?

Mel:
I love being around coaches and leaders. That’s how I learn. I’m not great with books — I prefer conversations, asking questions, picking at ideas.

I did a three-year course with leaders from different sports: Gareth Southgate, Steve Ball, Paula Dunn from athletics, Dave Allaway from boxing, and others. We had four workshops a year, doing crazy stuff: hostage negotiation exercises, abseiling, police pressure simulations.

I was paired with Gareth once. I didn’t like the exercise, and he encouraged me — I told him, “Don’t encourage me.” He realised sometimes people don’t want encouragement, they want to be left alone. It was a funny but powerful learning.

That cohort had a massive impact on me. We were all dealing with the same challenges.

Guy:
So finding your sources of inspiration is your own responsibility?

Mel:
Definitely. 100%. You’re a product of the people around you and the information you seek out. You have to seek the right stuff.

The problem is the news shows the negative every day. Imagine if Pride of Britain was on daily instead of once a year — there are amazing things happening all the time. You just have to look for them.

Transcript (Section 7)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
You spent time with 24 amazing sports coaches. What led to that, and who inspired you most?

Mel Marshall:
I interviewed four men and four women inside governing-body sport, four men and four women outside governing bodies, and four men and four women entrepreneurs. I had a thirst to understand what made good leadership and what made people successful.

It wasn’t academic — I can’t do that. It was just sitting down and absorbing wisdom for an hour at a time.

Take Eddie Jones. His love for rugby was incredible. When I asked about it, he grew 10 feet tall, leaned closer, and just wanted to tell me everything. He’s from a teaching background and his passion for the game shone through.

Then Gareth Southgate — such a measured approach, really listening to people, taking an interest in values. He’s endured a barrage of negativity, but at his core he’s a fabulous person, father, husband, role model. It doesn’t seem right that such a good person absorbs so much abuse.

Paula Dunn from British Athletics had this gift: she could deliver bad news and people would thank her for it, because of the way she communicated.

What I learned from all 24 leaders was authenticity. None of them did it the same way. They had all mastered themselves.

Transcript (Section 8)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
Switching direction — congratulations on your move to Australia. Beyond the weather, what excites you most about that journey?

Mel Marshall:
Well, Britain is a top four or five nation in the world. Australia is top one or two. The talent pool there is incredible, and swimming is one of their number one sports.

I’ve been in this organisation since I was seven. If not now, then when?

The environment excites me too. Here in Britain we’re indoors, sometimes with only 18 minutes of sunshine between November and February. Coaching outdoors, changing things up — that’s refreshing.

I’m 42, and I’ve done it this way for a long time. If not now, then when? I believe in jumping in deep water — that’s when you learn how to swim.

I’m yet to be the best version of myself as a coach. I feel I’ll get closer to that in Australia.

Guy:
And the best version of yourself — is that something you test against constantly?

Mel:
Yes. I want more consistency with the best version of me. There are things I still need to learn, ways I need to push and grow, and being uncomfortable will help me do that. A new environment, new people, new setup — all that will make me grow.

Guy:
What would you say are your super strengths?

Mel:
Engaging with people. Relationships. Entertainment. Innovation. Critical thinking. Performance-driven. Competitive. And I stick to my word.

Guy:
And your weaknesses?

Mel:
Terrible with detail. Terrible with data. I get distracted easily. I can be emotional — not outwardly, but inside. Empathy is my compass, which is both a strength and a weakness.

I feel too much on behalf of other people. If an athlete has a tough session, I feel it’s my fault. I carry that. I always feel everything’s my responsibility.

Guy:
So when you think about becoming the best version of yourself, do you focus on strengths or weaknesses?

Mel:
You have to focus on super strengths — that’s what makes you you. But I also need to work on weaknesses so my strengths can shine even more.

Transcript (Section 9)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
So when we catch up with you in Los Angeles or Brisbane in eight years’ time, what will the “future Mel” look like?

Mel Marshall:
The one thing I need to get absolutely better at is not feeling so heavily all the highs and lows with the athletes. Boundaries and separation are going to be really important.

Here in Britain, I’ve been so immersed. I grew up here, I’ve done everything here, and I’ve felt everything with my athletes. I hope that moving to Australia — with that space and separation — will help.

Guy:
And of course, Adam’s retired. So you’re moving away from what was almost a maternal relationship. You’re starting fresh with athletes you don’t yet have emotional bonds with.

Mel:
Yes. And that’s good. It gives me a chance to judge them purely as athletes, without that deep emotional entanglement. With Adam, Luke, Anna, Greg — I had them for six years plus. Adam came to me at 15, Luke at 8, Anna at 4. We spent seven hours a day together, travelling, training. I felt every single moment.

What Adam and I achieved is the best gift in the world. But because he was my first, I felt the whole thing so deeply. With the next generation, it will be a little less painful for me.

Guy:
And the benefit of that separation?

Mel:
It frees up capacity. Coaching Adam was emotionally brutal at times. By separating myself a bit, I’ll have more energy to coach more athletes to a high level.

Otherwise, it becomes like an addiction. You’re constantly thinking of ideas, trying to get ahead of everything, and it can damage your health and wellbeing. Having boundaries helps with fatigue, judgement, and perspective.

Guy:
So when you think about changes you’ll take to Australia, what comes to mind?

Mel:
I’m not going to be as soft. When you like people, you can drop your guard and end up compromising too often. But high performance isn’t about compromise.

And I’ll make decisions. In the past, I had a title but others made the key decisions about programmes, training, selections. I had autonomy over very little.

It was like being Elton John, going out to Wembley — but someone else had picked the piano, the songs, the orchestra. And yet I was expected to perform. You can’t do that.

In Australia, I’ll be the decision maker. That’s non-negotiable.

Guy:
And not just with athletes — you’ll now be managing coaches too.

Mel:
Yes. And that’s what I want. My dominant response is that I’m a decision maker. I want to make decisions under pressure, under challenge. That’s what excites me.

Transcript (Section 10)

Guy Gillon (Co-Founder, Tenzing):
Will you use specific frameworks with coaches? Because now you’re essentially setting a performance environment for them.

Mel Marshall:
Yes. I’m big on time — tasks have to be done on time. And they need to be of impeccable standard.

But enjoyment is vital too. People should want to be there. That’s non-negotiable for me.

In the past I’ve managed staff — PhDs, creative people — but I wasn’t the final decision maker. Now I will be. My job is to stay true to my values, help people understand what performance sport really is, and take them on the journey.

Margins are tiny in our sport. We’ve had seven fourth-place finishes by a combined 0.46 seconds. There isn’t much room for error. So we need openness, clarity, and a willingness to see it and say it — but always in the right way.

Guy:
Any final comments — or books you’d recommend?

Mel:
I’m not a massive reader, more of an audiobook person.

The Subtle Art of Not Giving a F*** is excellent. Will It Make the Boat Go Faster? is another good one.

I’m a big podcast listener. I like The High Performance Podcast. Jo Malone’s episode is excellent. General Sir Richard Dannatt, the army commander, is brilliant — though if you’ve got two hours!

So yes, podcasts are my go-to.

Guy:
I’m with you on that — a long run with an audiobook or podcast is perfect.

Mel:
Exactly.

Guy:
Mel, on behalf of us and thousands of British swimming and Olympic fans — thank you for everything you’ve done.

Mel:
Thank you very much.

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Closing

Karen Falcon (Host):
What a great chat with Mel Marshall. Hearing about how she “mapped the mountain” — making it easier to accept the terrain you’re on and having a plan for the inevitable challenges — really resonated. Plotting small goals, focusing on what’s in front of you.

We invited Mel to the Altitude Academy to speak with our team, and her message was similar: when it feels big, make it small.

If you enjoyed listening to this conversation and want to hear more inspiring stories, search “Tenzing” wherever you get your podcasts. We’d love you to rate and review this episode — and don’t forget to subscribe.

You can also find out more about us at Tenzing.pe, on LinkedIn, or on Instagram.

Bye for now.